heh, heh, good one!

Maranatha!
Don Johnson
Jerimiah 33.3

All righty then… so by that logic Abraham and Moses are Christians.

Sorry, that isn’t the truth. All men come to the Father through Christ (ultimately), but not all such men are Christians.

You speak like dispensationalism is a bad thing! Surprise, surprise, I am a dispensationalist.

And you are right, the speaker in this case is MacArthur.

Now, you’ve had your say on the point that bothers you, but we aren’t going to spend the rest of this thread arguing about whether John the Baptist was a Christian or not. That isn’t the point of the post.

Maranatha!
Don Johnson
Jer 33.3

Here’s what Jesus said: “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6)

Here’s what the apostles said: “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” (Acts 4:12)

So, if John is with the Father, if he is in heaven, he is in Christ.

Furthermore, Here’s what John’s mother said on hearing that Mary was pregnant with Jesus: “And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit, and she exclaimed with a loud cry, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And why is this granted to me that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For behold, when the sound of your greeting came to my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.” (Luke 1:39-45)

Elizabeth calls Jesus her Lord, and she is the forerunner of John. So, surely being a forerunner does not make it impossible to be a Christian. Plus, John leaps for joy at the news of Jesus — while still in the womb. John knew Jesus and believed in him. Jesus was John’s Lord — He said that he wasn’t worthy to carry Jesus’ sandals, he said that he needed Jesus’ baptism.

If you want to quible about “Christian” not existing as a term until later in history, fine. If your point is that John wouldn’t have been called a “Christian” in his lifetime, fine.

I’m not intending to fuss over a historical quibble or even some systematic theology nit-picking.

I’m intending to say that John’s faith was in the Lord Jesus Christ, and he preached and lived the necessity of repentence and trust in Christ.

Call that what you will, most people today call it “Christian.”

Oh, and I have no idea who the preacher you are referencing might be. If you say that he wouldn’t think John a Christian, then I’m guessing Macarthur — since he’s the only dispensationalist in the currently popular “conservative evagelical” club. And, the point you are making smells like dispensationalism.

Keith, I don’t think you can make a Biblical case for that assertion. Christians are disciples of Christ. John was never a disciple. The Bible never identifies him as such. He was the forerunner, he was a prophet, but he wasn’t a follower of Christ.

If you are making your assertion based on Covenant theology and the identification of Israel and the Church, well… you still don’t have a case.

And, FWIW, the speaker I am referencing in this post would not agree with you. He would not say that John the Baptist was a Christian.

Maranatha!
Don Johnson
Jer 33.3

Hi Brian

These little points would be one thing if they happened only one time in the series of four messages. We all mis-speak from time to time. (Some more than others!) But in this case, the errors were made repeatedly and stated in such a way as to be supporting material for the overall point being made.

and Hi Tracy

I agree with you about the ‘one size fits all’ approach. There is value in many different styles of preaching and each man needs to find his own niche. I tend toward expository, with an occasional topic thrown in (usually coming from something I saw in the exposition).

I have about 50% of those titles on your list. That might be a good blog post some time, just comparing the titles we have on preaching.

Maranatha!
Don Johnson
Jerimiah 33.3

In many cases I’m afraid we are forcing young preachers to go to war in Saul’s armor. Expository preaching isn’t for everybody, yet it’s presented as the only option. The truth is very few men do expository preaching well, much less attractively and coherently. And even those who are currently famed as great expositors suffer. Unfortunately, their reputation exceeds their presentation, if you know what I mean.

Over the years I’ve collected various books on sermon-crafting and preaching. Here are the ones I presently have in my library.

How to Improve Your Preaching (Bob Jones, Jr.)
Lectures on Preaching (Matthew Simpson)
The Theory of Preaching (Austin Phelps)
The Craft of Sermon Construction (W.E. Sangster)
Preaching and Preachers (D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones)
A Treatise on the Preparation and Delivery of Sermons (John A. Broadus)
The Preacher: His Life and Work (J. H. Jowett)
A Primer on Preaching (Alfred P. Gibbs)
He Expounded: A Guide to Expository Preaching (Douglas M. White)
The Fine Art of Preaching (A.W. Blackwood)
Doctrinal Preaching for Today (A.W. Blackwood)
Expository Preaching without Notes (Charles W. Koller)
Principles of Expository Preaching (Merrill F. Unger)
Preaching Biblically (Don. M. Wardlaw)
Lectures on Preaching (Phillips Brooks)
An Introduction to Contemporary Preaching (J. Daniel Baumann)

Needless to say, I enjoy books on preaching and sermon-crafting. At the end of the day, however, a preacher must know his own abilities and work from there. If he has the talent and temperament for expositional preaching, then he should pursue that style, and God will bless him. However, if his strengths lie elsewhere, perhaps in topical or doctrinal preaching, then he should cultivate that style and become as polished and dynamic as possible (“If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth”).

For my own part, I enjoy a variety of styles, mostly however expositional and textual. As a young preacher I listened to the pros and cons of the preaching debate. In the end, I settled on a style that fit me and then found several older men who practiced that style, observing them as carefully as I could. It was a great help to me. But this new “one size fits all” mentality in preaching will ultimately handcuff otherwise good preachers and turn loose others who will struggle with an imposed technique.

Have a good one!

tjp