Comments on: towards an understanding of worldliness – pt. 2 https://oxgoad.ca/2010/05/09/towards-an-understanding-of-worldliness-pt-2/ fundamentalism by blunt instrument Tue, 11 May 2010 00:57:27 +0000 hourly 1 By: ox https://oxgoad.ca/2010/05/09/towards-an-understanding-of-worldliness-pt-2/comment-page-1/#comment-5307 Tue, 11 May 2010 00:57:27 +0000 http://oxgoad.ca/2010/05/09/towards-an-understanding-of-worldliness-pt-2/#comment-5307 In reply to Jim Peet.

Hi Jim

These are excellent application questions. Can we start answering by identifying “ends of a spectrum” like this:

On the worldly/earthly/neutral side of the spectrum is the mundane activities of this life, paying bills, taking care of marital responsibilities, etc, as described in 1 Cor 7. These things can be distractions to ministry, but are not in themselves evil, but are worldly in the sense that they are things of this world.

On the worldly/fleshly/evil side would be the nightclub scene you note above. Perhaps there are even more worldly things than that, but it should suffice to identify the evil side of the spectrum.

Now, what about those things in between? I can remember a day when my dad would refuse to enter a licensed restaurant (i.e., one that sold alcohol). In those days, you often had a choice. Today, even many “family” restaurants are licensed, especially in our area.

It has been a while since I’ve been to much pro sports venues. We live on this island, see, and it is hard to get to a place where I can visit one. I have enjoyed sports (at times I think too much) since I was about 13 years old… so forty years. I have attended some pro and college sports events. There are elements in these events, as you describe, that are problematic for Christians. The near naked cheer leaders would fall under the category of evil, plain and simple, rather than simply ‘worldly’. The same is true of the foul language, and in my opinion, the drinking.

So as we start getting to Titus 2.12, Paul is going after a certain kind of desires that he calls ‘worldly’. This is what makes something worldly, if it stirs up these kinds of desires. The evil in the nightclub stirs up those desires for the people who attend. The evil in the cheer leaders, the desires behind the foul language, the lust for booze, these are what makes these things worldly.

In my opinion, the two key passages on worldliness are Titus 2.12 and then 1 Jn 2.15-17. As we progress in our study, that is where we are going.

Maranatha!
Don Johnson
Jer 33.3

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By: Jim Peet https://oxgoad.ca/2010/05/09/towards-an-understanding-of-worldliness-pt-2/comment-page-1/#comment-5304 Mon, 10 May 2010 18:50:39 +0000 http://oxgoad.ca/2010/05/09/towards-an-understanding-of-worldliness-pt-2/#comment-5304 Don,

Thanks for this article as well as the 1st. I recommended the 1st to my ABF class and I will recommend this one as well.

A question about this statement (which I agree with completely): “The activities that go on at nightclubs are almost entirely worldly in the negative sense”

What makes it worldly?

Let’s take a couple of other examples.

National casual dining establishment: I go with my wife on a Friday night to buy a hamburger, fries and a coke. In that same room is a large bar area where beer and hard liquor drinks are being served. In my community of believers (my church) eating at this establishment would not frowned upon or considered worldly.

Baseball or football game: I’ve been to both here in Minneapolis. Football … women dancing in attire about as lacking in modesty as a swimsuit. I’m in a row of patrons with 1/3 drinking beer. Around me foul language is being used to criticize the play or the refs / umpires. Church youth groups in my community go to events like these (well the baseball part … football is too expensive!).

Is attending sporting events worldly? How about the amusement theme park? Do Tertullian’s warnings in On the Spectacles have value?

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