denominationalists perspective

Most of my focus is on the independent Baptist perspective, but I ran across a recent conference that might be of interest from the perspective of denominationalists. The conference was called “Southern Baptists, Evangelicals, and the Future of Denominationalism”. It was held at Union University, October 6-9. You can read summaries of each session here and access the audio here.

Here are a couple of quotes that might be of interest to fundamentalists:

David Dockery:

Fundamentalists were unable to discern the difference between those who denied the deity of Christ and those who engaged in card-playing.

Can you feel the love?

Duane Litfin:

Evangelicalism broke free from the ghetto of fundamentalism, remaining mostly fundamentalist in theology, while demonstrating openness to intellectual and cultural engagement.

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let’s check out of movements?

Dave Doran gives us more concerning the fragmentation and death of the fundamentalist movement as such. There is a good deal of truth to his observations concerning the lack of unifying goals and the center of biblical focus for Christian unity and ministry.

He concludes:

The center of God’s will for this dispensation is in the local church (1 Tim 3:15). That’s where the unity of the Spirit is to be preserved in the bond of peace (Eph 4:3). The local church has been charged with the task of carrying out the Great Commission (since baptizing is an ordinance of the church). The movement that ought to matter most to us is one that aims to plant churches that will reproduce in every place where the name of Christ has not been named, and that movement must spring from local churches in order to be biblical. Sign me up for that movement.

I once met a preacher who told me that he wasn’t much for going to conferences and getting known. He just preferred to stay home and “hoe corn” (he pastored in the Midwest).

So in light of this non-movement movement sentiment, I wonders:

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on movement

Dave Doran gives us some thoughts on movements in general and the fundamentalist movement in particular.

In general, I think he is right. For a movement to exist, you have to be moving somewhere.

Given this understanding of movement, it is also correct to say that there is no longer a new-evangelical movement. But it isn’t correct to say there are no new-evangelicals or no new-evangelicalism. The philosophy is alive and well and expressed by many evangelicals repeatedly. It won’t do to say that new-evangelicalism is dead simply because the movement has ceased.

Among fundamentalists, there does seem to be a movement to push fundamentalism into some kind of alliance with evangelicals. We have been calling this movement the ‘young fundamentalists’. Some of us have been resisting this movement. Speaking for myself, my resistance to this movement is largely due to the fact that I don’t think the YFs truly understand either fundamentalism or evangelicalism and the entrenched divisions between them.

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equal interpreters in every church?

Who argues for this? In Kevin Bauder’s most recent article, he makes statements like this one (from near the beginning).

In the wake of Common Sense Realism and Populism, however, some evangelicals, including some Fundamentalists, have become confused about the meaning of these doctrines. They have distorted Sola Scriptura to mean Nuda Scriptura. They have replaced the perspicuity of the Scriptures with the perspicacity of every interpreter.

And these two statements come from near the end:

In some circles, one finds a naïve belief that a solitary individual, given no prior instruction, can simply sit down with a Bible and discover the entire Christian faith.

Nor can we afford to assume that by just starting from scratch we can avoid all the mistakes of the past.

I wonder who Bauder is talking about? Who argues that Christians in some Fundamentalist churches have no need of training, of understanding, of learning, of listening to well-trained pastors, or that none of this is necessary, all of Scripture is equally easy to understand by any Christian?

I don’t know anybody who argues for what Bauder is arguing against, even in the most anti-intellectual circles of Fundamentalism. Even there, training is thought necessary and not all are thought to have equal understanding. It is true that there are some circles that are more anti-intellectual than others, and that there are some schools that aren’t as good as others, and thus pastors/church leaders who are not as well prepared as they should be.

But who argues that “we don’t need no stinkin’ interpretation” or interpreters? It is a mystery to me.

Perhaps it is yon scarecrow against whom the professor raises his argument.

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what should fundamentalism look like?

One commenter offers an observation and a question:

Perhaps I’m wrong here, but I attribute much of fundamentalism’s current weakness to the secondhand lions now heading up its institutions and fellowships. Are there any fundamentalist institutions that currently model what fundamentalism should be?

Here’s the question I would like to ask you, Don, since I believe you’ll answer it partisanly but fairly. Fundamentalism as an idea is chic enough, but at some point it must take on a concrete expression. What in your opinion should a fully-dressed fundamentalism look like?

I agree with the observation.

But what should fundamentalism look like?

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fundamental issues, 21st century version

Mark Snoeberger is working on a series of articles called “A Fundamentalist raison d’etre” (except he knows how to put the fancy accent mark over the first ‘e’ in etre). In part 4 of his series, he highlights two issues that he believes are significant areas of concern in the conservative evangelical camp:

I am convinced that at least two doctrines deemed non-essential by the conservative evangelical majority are more essential than at first meets the eye, viz., cessationism and young earth creationism, which will be the topics of my next two posts. Ambivalence to these blind spots, in my mind, does not serve Christian unity, but rather functions to erode biblical authority. And that is something fundamentalism most definitely stands for.

I agree with him on these points.

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he’s at it again

Kevin Bauder has come out with another disappointing broadside against fundamentalism. He fills a recent article of Central Seminaries online publication, In the Nick of Time, with a series of scandalous charges against Fundamentalism.

I have summarized the charges as they appear in the article. I attempt to represent them accurately, working my way through the article paragraph by paragraph. If my summaries are inaccurate in any way, I invite correction where I may have erred.

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but…

Isn’t this exactly what some fundamentalists are doing with evangelicals they admire for one reason or another?

It is not helpful when fundamentalists try to discredit the evangelistic fruitfulness of Graham’s ministry or when evangelicals use that fruitfulness to justify all of Graham’s associations and actions. Both attempts are rooted in the same false assumption—God can only use those who are perfectly obedient (or close to it). … The evangelical, coming from the opposite angle but with the same assumption, feels compelled to argue that since God used Graham, what Graham was doing can’t be wrong (or, at least, not that bad).

Dave is giving some good analysis in his series of articles, but this paragraph seems to describe precisely the problem I have with the way some fundamentalists talk about their evangelical ‘faves’.

And I have one other point where I want to make a mild objection.

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reverse disclaimers

I was listening again this week to a presentation on the state of evangelicalism by a very prominent evangelical. I think this was delivered a year or two ago, I don’t remember exactly, just have the mp3 sitting on my hard drive.

The individual and the content of the address aren’t all that important for the purpose of this post. I was interested in how the speaker was describing various movements, in distinction with the evangelical movement.

My regular readers may remember how we have had some tussles over ‘disclaimers’ in the past few months. (Not that it is disclaimers I am after!!! I still protest that I am misunderstood.) But when fundamentalists talk about the need for disclaimers, it works this way:

The fundamentalist says something positive about some teacher/preacher outside “the camp”. The fundamentalist at the same time feels obligated to issue a disclaimer, making sure everyone knows that he knows that the guy he just said something nice about is bad in some way.

In evangelicalism, the opposite seems to be true. They use reverse disclaimers.

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fundamentalism applied to conduct

In the comments on “fundamentalism defined”, a certain ambiguity in the FBFI definition was noted at this point:

3. Endeavors to practice Biblical conduct in all areas of his life.

A question could be raised here: “So exactly how does this aspect of the definition differentiate you fundamentalists from conservative evangelicals? Don’t they believe in practicing Biblical conduct in all areas of life also?”

In my reply, I noted that other phrases of the definition might more clearly differentiate a fundamentalist from a conservative evangelical. I am willing to concede that in many ways, conservative evangelicals agree with fundamentalism in terms of “Biblical conduct in all areas of life.”

I will also concede that the statement as it stands is pretty open-ended. Everyone thinks that the way they apply the Bible to their life is the ‘Biblical’ way.

However, let’s be really clear… Fundamentalists are not vague and uncertain about what they believe to be biblical conduct.

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